The Cow Conundrum

[Murder-of-Crows]

I am puzzled about one thing in Esteren. In the section about food, the book explicitly mentions the rarity of milk and cheese. Apparently, only goats and boernacs provide milk. Also, there is no beef mentioned when talking about meat.

But in the chapter on travelling, the book uses "bovine" as adjective - implying cows.

In the equipment chapter, I can even buy an ox.

Now an ox is a castrated bull, and you can't have bulls without cows. But cows imply milk.

So, are there cows (and thus milk and beef) in Tri-Kazel or not?

[iznurda]

Well, this one of the thing I disagree with the book 1, Universe. A thing like milk should be more used than describe. But we can consider that boernacs, the native bovine of tri-kazel, give very few milk. The cows have come from the continent with the horses, but be primarily reared for meat or trait. The inhabitants of the peninsula are traditionalists and habits, even with food, slowly changing.

On an other side, this is the point of view and it could not be representative of real fact ; the narrator may originate from a region with few resources. As he travels few his opinion is biased. In my opinion you can take some liberties with the food, while maintaining consistency with the climate grape or not heat-loving plants. Any food that can be stored during the winter or providing good resistance to harsh climate (or field) is preferred beans, walnuts, chestnuts, tubers, cereals (spelt, buckwheat, barley, oats). Hemp and flax are used for textiles, but also to draw the oil.

There are also many herbs to complement the dishes, and find some spices should not be difficult (some bark, seeds strong taste, etc.)

If that helps you

iz

[ikaar]

Bovines exist. They came from Continent with horses. I m agree with that. They are less suited to the peninsula, and pure bovines are rather few.
But one might think that Cows could have been crossed with Boernacs, which could be considered closely related species.
This race, after these multiple various crosses, could represent what we call the cattle of the peninsula, including near bulls, cows and oxen. But, once again, they are less suited to the climate and relief, but could produce more milk.

On an other side, this is the point of view and it could not be representative of real fact ; the narrator may originate from a region with few resources.

Absolutely agreed with that. The text FOOD is a fabliau, an ancient story with moral issues. Moreover, it has been told decades ago (with firsts incomings of men from the Continent). So, you have some liberties with that. This particular text is quite a poetic license in book 1 universe.

The inhabitants of the peninsula are traditionalists and habits, even with food, slowly changing.

Indeed.

Then, if there was crossings between the few Continent's cattle and boernacs, it took a long time, at least three generations i think and probably more, to obtain something that we could call cow, bovines, bull...

[Murder-of-Crows]

Thanks for your insight. The text on Food was one of my favorites, because it really makes Esteren different. Sorry to see that it is rather poetic licence... But okay, I can live with that. I can always use what I like and leave the rest.

[iznurda]

Like you, I love the text but I think he is more restrictive than it should be. But peninsula can have lots of vegetable and food we don't have. Anyway I think they eat more fish than meat, fishing is easier than hunting and it's hard to reserve fields for livestock feed.

Don't hesit to share your point of view on this point. I'm really intrigued by the way you approach the thing thought.

iz

[ikaar]

Murder, don't be worry. I'm the author of FOOD. When i talk about poetic licence, i just mean that it is a tale told by a bard, like a "jongleur" from middle-age in french.

Concerning the information in the text, you should know that i have respected an "Esteren Bible" in the creative processus and i put it all the information that should be teached in the text, just involving in a form more "different" from a traditionnal rpg text.

The specific form from FOOd was inspired by a famous quote from a theatrical text nammed "Cyrano de Bergerac" written in french by Edmond Rostand, in 1897.

BUT the informations were right in the text. Just, it could seem restrictive to some gamemasters and you are free to take liberties with that. The fact that it is a tale give you this opportunity.

[Murder-of-Crows]

ikaar, this was the one of the most memorable stories I read in the Universe book. It made Esteren come alive in a couple of ways. I especially liked the twist with the poisoned food. It painted a very vivid picture.

I really want to get Esteren "right", meaning I want to understand why things are a certain way before even considering to change them. Also, it really intrigues me that there are no cows (and thus a scarcity of milk and cheese, as well as no beef). It's a small detail that serves to set Esteren apart and make it memorable. Also, there are potatoes (which were unknown in medieval Europe) which makes coming up with meals a lot easier.

So, these are elements I like and enjoy. My initial question was prompted by curiosity, not out of a desire to change something.

[Elenyl Forgelune]

Murder-of-Crow, as you want to get Esteren "right", you have to keep in mind that all what is said in the Universe book is not all true. I mean it's a partial vision of some people that live in this world. They don't know everything (they are far from in fact) and they only describe what they are used to see.
Food is somewhat a particular text, as Ikaar explained, and so it couldn't be exhaustive.
If there are no or so few cows in Tri-Kazel, you'll find Boernacks that are closer to buffalos. Their milk is not so tasty, nor fat enough, and the production may be quite more difficult to assume, what can explain cheese and milk are not so common....

Hope this can help !

Elenyl, eating and drinking...